Tantabus
Filters (Default) SettingsRegisterLogin
Creator Tags - Should we simplify them? Opine Here!

Possible change to Creator tags. [Opinions needed]

Site and Policy » Possible change to Creator tags. [Opinions needed] Search Posts
Started by Heat Sink
Posted
19 replies
Subscribe
Heat Sink

Moderator
Hello Everypony (and other creatures),
we, the Staff have been discussing a topic which we would like the community’s opinion on.
Since the start of Tantabus there have been three sorts of creator tags. “Prompter”, “Editor” & “Artist”
Now, there has been talks in the staff channels to combine these three creator tags into a single tag.
The staff already came up with a few suggestions like keeping “Prompter” as the single unified creator tag, but we also thought of alternatives like “Creator” or “Director”. if you have any idea or preference what this tag should be called if it is decided to continue this change, we would love to hear it.
This does not impact the “AI generated” & “AI Composition” tags. These will be functioning the same if it is decided that we go through with this change.
We would like to know your opinion on this idea, if you think this change will be a good idea or not, and to help us with ideas what to name this unified tag.
Posted Report
Zerowinger

3-3/4" Army Man Fan
I guess “Creator” could work with more involved works that are more AI composition rather than purely AI generated that required significant editing or inputs outside of just prompts. However I think the other tags should remain, especially “Prompter,” given how many works are just generations and only involve prompts.
Posted Report
Heat Sink

Moderator
@Scarlet Ribbon
One of the reasons that i think we should unify the tags is because of users having to have separate tags to correctly tag there images.
For example i have seen one user that made an “artist” tag for themselves as the image they uploaded was a sketch using an AI image as base. And people following the users “Prompter” tag don’t see this image unless they stumble upon their profile and see that they also have an artist tag. I have seen several users that had to make a new creator tag to properly tag the image. With a unified tag a creator can put all their AI based art on one creator tag.
Posted Report
Heat Sink

Moderator
@Zerowinger
We already have the “AI generated” & “AI composition” tags for this distinction.
Personally i feel that it would be redundant to also have a distinction in creator tags for it. When there can be a neutral unified tag that can signify who made it, and then the Generated or Composition tags for what kind of image it is.
Posted Report
Zerowinger

3-3/4" Army Man Fan
@Heat Sink
For creating a unified tag for identifying who made stuff, I guess it makes sense. I guess it’s more of a personal thing as I’m not really comfortable being referred to as a “creator,” when in my opinion I’m not really creating anything. I’m not sketching a start image or editing a traditional art image I made, I’m just entering text into a UI and clicking a button until I get something I like. At best I’ll evolve/duplicate generations and clean them up afterwards, but I still don’t know if that really makes me a creator.
I know this is kind of relitigating some of the arguments about AI that was had on Derpi and elsewhere, but to me it just feels like the term should be reserved for people who go beyond simple text prompting.
Posted Report
Scarlet Ribbon

True Wildcard
@Heat Sink
I can’t agree with making tags less distinct across the entire site to solve what is honestly going to be a pretty uncommon edge case. However, there might be some value in adding a ‘creator:xxxxxxx’ tag that is implied by any artist/prompter/editor tag if that edge case is important.
Posted Report
MareStare

Mare Zealot
I fully agree with @Heat Sink. It is indeed inconvenient to have several different ways to denote the author of the image. If you take a look at my user profile, you’ll see a combinatorial explosion of various authorship tags linked to my socials, because “artist links” were not well designed for having several authorship tags referring to the same person. It’s also very annoying that different tags that refer to the same person have different followership, and thus if people are subscribed to prompter:marestare, for example, they won’t see new posts that contain editor:marestare or artist:marestare without the prompter:marestare tag. For this reason, I’ve been adding several variants of the authorship tags to my posts.
It does seem very logical to decouple the authorship from the “level of human effort” categories of tags. Even on derpibooru, I think it would make sense to separate these concerns. For edits of other works, there could be a tag “edit”, and if people want to clarify who did what in multi-authored posts, they can do that via the description.
As for the unified tag naming, I don’t like the term “director”. I know it comes from e6ai, but I don’t like their choice because this tag doesn’t look all that intuitive for an outside person. An outside person would indeed look for something called creator or author. I think both are fine, but I lean more towards author for no specific reason other than maybe that it’s shorter.
LightningBolt

Administrator
ADHD fueled
@MareStare
It’s also very annoying that different tags that refer to the same person have different followership, and thus if people are subscribed to prompter:marestare, for example, they won’t see new posts that contain editor:marestare or artist:marestare without the prompter:marestare tag. For this reason, I’ve been adding several variants of the authorship tags to my posts.
That sounds like a feature and not a bug, actually. Someone watching a person’s artist: tag may simply not be interested in their photographer: or editor: tag, so, no actually, those tags all exist separately for a reason, and using them all on the same image defeats the point and sounds silly to me. If someone wants to follow them all, they can, if they don’t want to, they shouldn’t be forced to. it’s not an all or nothing thing, they’re different things, and that’s okay.
(For the record, I’m against tag name unification)
Posted Report
Teaspoon

poni
Was already stated, but main reasons this was brought up are:
  1. Redundant tagging separation, as we already have ai composition, ai generated, and ai assisted to separate “artistic effort”
  2. The way the site handles user links means people that do multiple types of content sort of get shafted; if someone sees prompter:blah and clicks for more, they won’t see all their artist:blah or editor:blah. Yes, site profile lists those… but that assumes there is a profile, and that the user knows to click on it to check… not great
  3. Automatic tagging from uploading currently defaults to prompter:blah, something uploaders might not change when appropriate
Basically we don’t want to lose the whole “separating pure prompted work from heavily guided and edited work” functionality, but the current way of doing it through both the type and origin tag seems clunky and overall detrimental.
As for the name of the tag itself, that’s far from settled. creator:blah felt neutral, director:blah is what’s used in e6ai so maybe people are used to that. author:blah could definitely work. There’s also producer:blah, or simply just by:blah.
Posted Report
Teaspoon

poni
@LightningBolt
Thankfully watchlists allow for complex queries and they can just do artist:blah AND NOT photo; yes the reverse path of someone adding all the different origin tags to their watchlist could also work, but, I strongly suspect your scenario is far less common than “I want to watch all this person’s stuff”, so less overall friction.
Posted Report
LightningBolt

Administrator
ADHD fueled
@Teaspoon
You…assume it’s more common for people to want to follow everything a person makes all at once? ._.;
Well then.
I am aware complex watching and filtering exists, I am also aware that most people find it too complicated, and to my perspective, keeping things as they are creates the least amount of issues imo.
Posted Report
MareStare

Mare Zealot
Thankfully watchlists allow for complex queries and they can just do artist:blah AND NOT photo; yes the reverse path of someone adding all the different origin tags to their watchlist could also work, but, I strongly suspect your scenario is far less common than “I want to watch all this person’s stuff”, so less overall friction.
Basically, my thoughts as well. To me, it’s apparent that people more often want to subscribe to everything the person creates. I find the use case of the complex “author but not photo” much less common, especially given that this site is generally less diverse in types of content than Derpibooru. Other social media sites like X, BlueSky etc. don’t even have a feature of complex filter and people live fine subscribing to everything from the person. Also, if people aren’t interested in author’s photo stuff, it’s likely they aren’t interested in any photos at all and may just hide that tag sitewide.
So, given that there is still solution, I vote that it’s better to prioritise a more common case as the default. I.e. “Simple things should be simple, complex things should be possible”. Of course this isn’t built on any statistics, just on my sense.
Posted Report
Teaspoon

poni
@LightningBolt
You…assume it’s more common for people to want to follow everything a person makes all at once? ._.;
I mean, yeah? I see it much more likely that someone would go “I want to follow everything this person does” than “I want to follow what this person does except this content type”, and in the latter case I’d expect that person to know how filters and watchlists work.
keeping things as they are creates the least amount of issues
I just really don’t see it that way.
On a personal level, a lot of the stuff I work on, I spend a fair bit of time on, sketch out parts, clean up errors, add in details, splice backgrounds and characters into one image, etc. Others I just get a p.cool looking image out of the gate and just do some minor fixes. Currently I tag both as “prompter” because I can’t be arsed with having two tags (especially when the resulting visual differences between both image types isn’t all that noticeable and I’m pretty much the only one that knows).
And I can just, like, add it to myself. For the average user that wants to have a profile here, they have to request a prompter link. And then an editor link. And maybe an artist link, too. Their profile now has at least 3 different origin tags. Now multiply that by how many other places they post on.
And additionally, the scenario where someone uploads an image they think is one type, but is actually another. To fix it, someone needs to fix both the “artist” tag and the “ai something” tag.
Otherwise, the tags are wrong, as these redundant set of tags have to match. A discordance the site already suffers from.
Posted Report
FoalFucker

logically multiple artists tags are pointless when the composition, generated, assisted tags do the same thing. BUT at the same time you should let people be if they really want to hide there low effort work otherwise well just end up with multiple different names for the same creator. But if we do combine, why not just name it artist to standardize?
Also why do we even have an “ai generated” tag when it’s the majority default? If people want to differentiate then we have AI Comp and Assisted. i always forget and so do a lot of others since it doesn’t make sense for an all AI booru.
truekry

Wizzard
@Zerowinger
I guess it makes sense. I guess it’s more of a personal thing as I’m not really comfortable being referred to as a “creator,” when in my opinion I’m not really creating anything. I’m not sketching a start image or editing a traditional art image I made, I’m just entering text into a UI and clicking a button until I get something I like. At best I’ll evolve/duplicate generations and clean them up afterwards, but I still don’t know if that really makes me a creator.
It kind of does, in my opinion. You created the text and you edit. You help in the creative effort and in doing so makes you a creator. We can debate the involvement level needed to define this more but that isn’t the point. That’s was the other ai level tags are for. Creator has a nice ring to it in my opinion.
Heat Sink

Moderator
Even with unified tags it is still possible for creators to seperate their art vs edits by just making a second creatpr tag like for example creator:(user) & creator:(user)edits. But with the unified tag we give the creator the choice if they want to have it seperate or combined. Now it feels like it is forced to be seperate.
Posted Report
tyto4tme4l

Something of an artist
I think the unification is a good idea. Personally, I lean toward “prompter” as the unified tag, but “creator” would also be fine.
Posted Report
Scarlet Ribbon

True Wildcard
I think staff need to seriously think about what they’re proposing here: Regardless of the name you ultimately decide on, what you are doing is effectively removing the entire existence of editor/artist tags. You are functionally REMOVING distinctions because a limited number of people don’t want to learn to use the site correctly.
As I mentioned before, adding an additional implied unified tag (credit:xxxxx?) solves both issues.
Posted Report
Edited
Interested in advertising on Tantabus? Click here for information!
WhyCloud - Create Fearlaessly

To provide you with Tantabus for free, we need money - help support us financially!

Edit Preview
Syntax quick reference: **bold** *italic* ||hide text|| `code` __underline__ ~~strike~~ ^sup^ ~sub~

Detailed syntax guide